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What Would Stoics Do

Epictetus · c. 50 – c. 135 CE

Discourses 3.9 ¶2 — Epictetus

From “To a Certain Rhetorician Who Was Going Up to Rome on a Suit”

Translation by George Long (1877)

Epictetus, Discourses 3.9 ¶2

Then you will say, “I met with Epictetus as I should meet with a stone or a statue:” for you saw me, and nothing more. But he meets with a man as a man, who learns his opinions, and in his turn shows his own. Learn my opinions, show me yours, and then say that you have visited me. Let us examine one another: if I have any bad opinion, take it away; if you have any, show it. This is the meaning of meeting with a philosopher. “Not so,” (you say): “but this is only a passing visit, and while we are hiring the vessel, we can also see Epictetus. Let us see what he says.” Then you go away and say: “Epictetus was nothing; he used solecisms and spoke in a barbarous way.” For of what else do you come as judges?—Well, but a man may say to me, “if I attend to such matters (as you do), I shall have no land, as you have none; I shall have no silver cups, as you have none; nor fine beasts, as you have none.” In answer to this it is perhaps sufficient to say: I have no need of such things; but if you possess many things, you have need of others; whether you choose or not, you are poorer than I am. “What then have I need of?” Of that which you have not: of firmness, of a mind which is conformable to nature, of being free from perturbation. Whether I have a patron or not, what is that to me? but it is something to you. I am richer than you: I am not anxious what Caesar will think of me. For this reason, I flatter no man. This is what I possess instead of vessels of silver and gold. You have utensils of gold; but your discourse, your opinions, your assents, your movements (pursuits), your desires are of earthen ware. But when I have these things conformable to nature, why should I not employ my studies also upon reason? for I have leisure: my mind is not distracted. What shall I do, since I have no distraction? What more suitable to a man have I than this? When you have nothing to do, you are disturbed, you go to the theatre or you wander about without a purpose. Why should not the philosopher labor to improve his reason? You employ yourself about crystal vessels; I employ myself about the syllogism named the lying; you about myrrhine vessels; I employ myself about the syllogism named the denying (τοῦ ἀποφάσκοντος). To you everything appears small that you possess; to me all that I have appears great. Your desire is insatiable; mine is satisfied. To (children) who put their hand into a narrow-necked earthen vessel and bring out figs and nuts, this happens: if they fill the hand, they cannot take it out, and then they cry. Drop a few of them and you will draw things out. And do you part with your desires: do not desire many things and you will have what you want.
— Epictetus, Discourses 3.9 ¶2 · tr. George Long (1877)Read in context →

Cite this passage

Epictetus, Discourses 3.9 ¶2, tr. George Long (1877)

https://whatwouldstoicsdo.com/passage/discourses/3.9.2

Epictetus, Discourses (as recorded by Arrian), tr. George Long (1877). Text: Standard Ebooks (CC0). Sources and licences

Read Book III, Chapter 9 in context →

In plain English

AI-written notes

A person with few possessions can be richer in what matters than someone rich in things, because wealth creates needs, anxiety about patrons and desires that can never be filled. Like a child whose full fist cannot leave the jar, loosen your grip on some desires and you will get what you actually need. A meeting with a wise person should be a mutual examination of opinions, not a casual sightseeing stop.

Older wording

“solecisms”
— grammatical mistakes
“myrrhine”
— made of a costly decorative stone
“perturbation”
— emotional disturbance

Themes and situations

  • Desire and craving
  • Simplicity and frugality
  • Wealth and poverty
  • Peace of mind
  • Freedom
  • Money, status and wanting more
  • Envy and comparison
  • Anxiety about the future

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